tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post2800583045685114028..comments2024-02-28T22:03:57.237-05:00Comments on The Automatic Earth: Debt Rattle, June 3 2008: What goes up must come down harderIlargihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09698428009501267664noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-21966220048700943662008-06-05T18:40:00.000-04:002008-06-05T18:40:00.000-04:00"...the value of the house has gone up due to infl...<I>"...the value of the house has gone up due to inflation"</I><BR/><BR/>That little sentence shows both why you are wrong, and why inflation should be left out of these discussions.Ilargihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09698428009501267664noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-28767521058268802782008-06-05T05:45:00.000-04:002008-06-05T05:45:00.000-04:00"Moreover: I did address inflation specifically:'...."Moreover: I did address inflation specifically:<BR/><BR/>'..forget about inflation for now, (or imagine how inflationary these mortgage schemes are).'"<BR/><BR/>I did see that, but that (in my opinion) is what makes your analysis so dishonest. Over the past generations, on average more than half of interest income on "safe" investments has gotten lost to inflation (then throw in taxes on the Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-17828550916601759482008-06-04T17:14:00.000-04:002008-06-04T17:14:00.000-04:00Greyzone,Thank you for your comments, I have thoug...Greyzone,<BR/>Thank you for your comments, I have thought about what you have said and I will heed what you say.<BR/><BR/><BR/>A few more thoughts, I am not a US citizen and live in Africa, maybe I feel the actions of the FED etc are not directly affecting me but as I am interested I read blogs such as this. Yes we are secondarily affected by the course of the USA due to its far reaching power/ HappySurferhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02616436901153873742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-47953384459278685542008-06-04T13:43:00.000-04:002008-06-04T13:43:00.000-04:00You are right of course that what we respond to in...You are right of course that what we respond to in our comments, is the bits of what you wrote that spark some thoughts in our own head. That's how reading and commenting is. Sometimes what interests us isn't the same as the main point you were trying to make. I'm sorry if I frustrate you by falling for distractions from the main issue you were trying to talk about. <BR/><BR/>Even if a Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-51044216398496967702008-06-04T10:38:00.000-04:002008-06-04T10:38:00.000-04:00...your analysis is horribly flawed, completely wo...<I>...your analysis is horribly flawed, completely worthless, and perhaps even (perhaps intentionally) misleading.</I><BR/><BR/>No, you are not a very good reader, that’s all. If people think I am not bright enough to understand the issues (or that I am, and intend to mislead for some reason), by all means, have your fun. <BR/><BR/>But I do know, and very well, that it’s possible to bring up Ilargihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09698428009501267664noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-89939293448631406632008-06-04T09:48:00.000-04:002008-06-04T09:48:00.000-04:00Ric,I don’t doubt that Main Street does work for W...Ric,<BR/><BR/>I don’t doubt that Main Street does work for Wall Street, nor that the creators of the Federal Reserve were skilled in their manipulation of power. <BR/><BR/>Perhaps I was unclear in my original comment, but I was primarily responding to HappySurfer’s statement that “they know and understand the final outcome for their personal greed” and apply “concerted effort over decades” to Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-47400304048727681712008-06-04T08:17:00.000-04:002008-06-04T08:17:00.000-04:00I agree with your conclusion that today's banks la...I agree with your conclusion that today's banks lack any sense of community responsibility, but your analysis is horribly flawed, completely worthless, and perhaps even (perhaps intentionally) misleading.<BR/><BR/>The value of those future dollars has to be discounted to reflect the loss of purchasing power. I keep reading that the dollar has lost 97+% of its value over the past ninety-five yearsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-24847094161726705062008-06-04T02:55:00.000-04:002008-06-04T02:55:00.000-04:00Happy Surfer,May I suggest that you study the hist...Happy Surfer,<BR/><BR/>May I suggest that you study the history of the formation of the Federal Reserve? It's instructive. The very people who deliberately caused the Panic of 1907 were the same ones who acted as the board to design the Federal Reserve.<BR/><BR/>May I also suggest that you review public organizations like the <A HREF="http://www.cfr.org/" REL="nofollow">Council on Foreign Greyzonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03675706201111951125noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-17201397953011019672008-06-03T21:19:00.000-04:002008-06-03T21:19:00.000-04:00SomeAnon,It takes little analysis to see that Main...SomeAnon,<BR/>It takes little analysis to see that Main Street works for Wall Street, which is criminal. Was the National Monetary Commission, and it's chairman, Nelson Aldrich, who wrote the Federal Reserve Act of 1913, unskilled in their design? Did the commission consist of fair-minded public servants trying to stabilize our money supply or were they titans concentrating power? Did the Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-54181022011028008102008-06-03T18:33:00.000-04:002008-06-03T18:33:00.000-04:00happyNo, I'm sorry, I can't really see a question,...happy<BR/><BR/>No, I'm sorry, I can't really see a question, it feels to me like you're circling the wagons.<BR/><BR/>-----------<BR/><BR/>dark matter<BR/><BR/>I use the Bailey S&L metaphor for specific reasons, not to say that the film should be dissected. My point is to discuss money flows in loan industries, not architecture or town planning.<BR/><BR/>Blaming Bailey or thrifts in general for Ilargihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09698428009501267664noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-72205650633341673172008-06-03T17:18:00.000-04:002008-06-03T17:18:00.000-04:00HappySurfer,I agree that a concerted 'conspiracy' ...HappySurfer,<BR/><BR/>I agree that a concerted 'conspiracy' is not happening.<BR/><BR/>Human beings it seems love to use hindsight to draw conclusions about the causation of past (and historic) events. While sometimes they are correct, the ensuing speculation about the motivation behind the causation is pure speculation.<BR/><BR/>One can see and is aware of the beneficiaries of such events Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-90189637535382244192008-06-03T17:00:00.000-04:002008-06-03T17:00:00.000-04:00Jim Kunstler did a post once on Its a Wonderful Li...Jim Kunstler did a post once on Its a Wonderful Life titled Not So Wonderful. Google "Kunstler George Bailey" to find it. He points out that auto accessed suburbia is the unintended consequence of George's good intentions and that rather than a Potterville with bars and brothels lining main street, main street is today boarded up and people go to Walmart. Where did George go wrong? What better Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-39907758276505172342008-06-03T16:08:00.000-04:002008-06-03T16:08:00.000-04:00Ilargi,I ask rhetorically as I am either not capab...Ilargi,<BR/><BR/>I ask rhetorically as I am either not capable of understanding or I just can't believe...<BR/><BR/>Many times you, and other esteemed readers ( Stoneleigh, GZ and others) have pointed out that the times we live in are a "direct" manipulation by "interested parties” and they know and understand the final outcome for their personal greed.<BR/><BR/>I understand and believe that HappySurferhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02616436901153873742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-34594011311105844812008-06-03T15:46:00.000-04:002008-06-03T15:46:00.000-04:00Houses that were built decades ago to last 100 yea...Houses that were built decades ago to last 100 years, represent(ed) the character, values and ethics of the people that built them.<BR/><BR/>Same with todays shit boxes that will be outlasted by the paper the notes are written on.<BR/><BR/>This is the root reason the US is doomed in it's present form.<BR/><BR/>The economy, politics and most everything else discussed (or not) are just the symphtom.VLADhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07303463697333210934noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-82552758606193879862008-06-03T14:40:00.000-04:002008-06-03T14:40:00.000-04:00brian,You either don't understand what I'm saying,...brian,<BR/><BR/>You either don't understand what I'm saying, or you pretend to. I'm talking about mortgages, not property taxes or insurance, and bringing them up just obfuscates the issue. You'd presumably pay those extra costs regardless. <BR/><BR/>Yes, times have changed since Bailey's S&L, but that has no bearing on the argument that over the course of 100 years, 30 times or more the cost of Ilargihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09698428009501267664noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4921988708619968880.post-35135091268875085482008-06-03T13:29:00.000-04:002008-06-03T13:29:00.000-04:00You know Ilargi, I live pretty close to the Bailey...You know Ilargi, I live pretty close to the Bailey scenario you describe, in a 100,000$ house that is over a century old and still in good shape, bought through a local Credit Union rather than a national bank.<BR/><BR/>And you are leaving some things out. First, property tax, I want there to be schools and fire departments in my town, right? Then housing insurance. Then even my credit union, Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com